berber-online.de

Hallo Kim, willkommen im Berber-Forum! Schreibst Du uns aus Amerika?
Hast Du Berber?

Habe diese Seiten gefunden: http://www.raresteeds.com/Breeds/spanish_barb.htm
http://www.conquistador.com/mustang.html
http://www.spanishbarb.com/
Bist Du da dabei?

Wegen Sätteln kann Dir vielleicht Anja helfen, sie hat gute Kontakte nach Nordafrika u. kann alles besorgen. Siehe auch hier:
http://www.berber-online.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516

Hi Rashidia,

I do not own a Spanish Barb, I own a Barb. Here is the website: www.originalhorses.org

The bloodline of these Barbs go back to the Barbs that were imported to the New World during the Spanish conquest. They are proven through historical data, conformation, and bone. All data on these horses goes back to the original Barb with NO Arabian influence. I feel that the bloodline of the American Barbs are extremely important in the preservation of the pure Barb. I hope to start a training and breeding program with the Barb in the USA. I am just focusing on the bloodline of Barb that has no Arabian. The International Barb Horse Registry only registers pure Barb horses with no outside influence of different breeds.

I really hope to get a Barb costume for my horse as well as a costume for me! Thank you for pointing me in the right direction.

Kimberlee

Ich bestize ein berber, kein spanisches berber. Hier ist die Webseite: www.originalhorses.org

Die Geburt ein amerikaner berber, sind mit die berber, die während spanischen (conquest) nach amerika importiert worden waren, verwandt. Ein Amerikaner berber hast arab nicht. Ein International Barb Horse Registry doch registers Reinzucht berber.

Ich Hoffnung einen berber sattel für meine berber stute und einen mich. Vielen danke für die auskunft.

Kimberlee

Hi Kimberlee,

first, you are cordially welcome. I'm glad to welcome a barb breeder from USA.

Thank you very much for your link. It's very interesting for us to see barbs in other countries.

I splitted the thread because to talk about american barbs ist an new topic.

I hope you enjoy this bulletin board

Hi Kim,

it´s a pleasure to meet a barb breeder from the US here at www.berber-online.de.

I took a look at your homepage. It is very interesting to see how much different types of barbs can be found - just as much as in the countries of origin . Is there a special breeding standard in the US? Have the stallions to pass a test before they become a breeding stallion - like "Körung" in Germany? Or is it possible to breed with any stallion with papers of origin?
What´s about "The International Barb Horse Registry"? I´ve never heard of something like that. In Europe there is the OMCB existing, which looks to prevent the Barb - but even so the Arab-Barb.
Why do you dislike Arabian influence? The two races are very related. In most cases you can´t even proof, that the pure Bare is really a pure one .

I konw, these are a lot of questions - but we don´t have "Barb-visit" from the US that often !

Kind regards
Jessica

The Arabian is exactly the opposite of the Barb from my experience. Totally different in shape and mind set. My Barb will take great care of me, and Arabs that I have ridden are not even aware of themselves let alone me! They do not understand anything about self preservation. Reports of Arabians being scared and jumping off of cliffs is not so uncommon! I personally know of an Arabian named Mächen that was scared and rolled down a hill side and into a cactus! Thankfully the rider was ok and so was the horse! In other instances, Arabians have become scared and jumped off of cliffs! Such as in Malibu, California. An Arabian jumped off a 61 meter cliff to its death! The rider jumped off of the stupid animal just in time! This has also occured on the famous Tevis Cup endurance ride. From all of these experiences, I would say the only similarity the Barb has to the Arabian is they both come from the desert and are hot in spirit!
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Der Araber ist genau Entgegengesetztes des Berber von meiner Erfahrung. Völlig verschieden in der Gestalt und Meinung geht unter. Mein Berber wird große Sorge von mir nehmen, und Araber, die ich geritten habe, sind von sich selbst ganz zu schweigen von mir nicht sogar bewusst! Sie verstehen nichts über selbst Bewahrung. Berichte von Arabern, die erschreckt werden und von Klippen springen, sind nicht so ungewöhnlich! Ich weiß persönlich von einem Araber genannt Mächen, der erschrocken war und unten eine Hügel-Seite und in einen Kaktus rollte! Dankbar war der Reiter ok und war so das Pferd! In anderen Beispielen sind Araber erschrocken geworden und sprangen von Klippen! Wie in Malibu, Kalifornien. Ein Araber sprang von einer 61-Meter-Klippe zu seinem Tod! Der Reiter sprang von des dummen Tieres gerade rechtzeitig! Das ist auch auf der berühmten Tevis-Tasse-Dauerfahrt vorgekommen. Von allen diesen Erfahrungen würde ich die einzige Ähnlichkeit sagen, die der Berber dem Araber hat ist sie beide kommen aus der Wüste und sind im Geist heiß!

Here is my Barb mare. Her name is La Victoria:

Shown with half Barb filly.




The website I gave is the website to the International Barb Horse Registry. They have been around since 1975. The founder has done a thorough research on the pure Barb horse for over 50 years. He is currently writing a book about the Barb and how it came to be in America. The IBHR's studbook is actually closed, so it only registers horses who come from already proven stock that it has accepted. I do not know if the OMCB would recognize the American Barb or if the other Barb registries would register the American Barb. I would very much like to become involved with other people that have Barb horses. I would be curious to see if the other Barb registries would register my mare and if the OMCB would accept the American Barb. The IBHR is preserving the Barb that originally came over to the Americas 500 years ago and any Barb overseas that is of pure ancestry.

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Die Website, die ich gab, ist die Website zur Internationalen Berber-Pferd-Registrierung. Sie sind ringsherum seit 1975 gewesen. Der Gründer hat eine gründliche Forschung über das reine Berber-Pferd seit mehr als 50 Jahren getan. Er schreibt zurzeit ein Buch über den Berber, und wie es kam, um in Amerika zu sein. Das Gestütbuch des IBHR wird wirklich geschlossen, so schreibt es nur Pferde ein, die bereits bewiesenes Lager herkommen, dass es akzeptiert hat. Ich weiß nicht, ob der OMCB den amerikanischen Berber anerkennen würde, oder wenn die anderen Bartfaden-Registrierungen würden

I am sorry my German is so poor. I am trying to find a tutor or classes in my area, but that has proven rather difficult. Hopefully one day I will reply in besten deutsch!

Kimberlee

Hi Kim

Interesting link - the horses shown at the Qien Sabe ("Who knows"? ) Ranch remind me a lot of a report in TV I once saw about a group of wild mustangs - I don't remember anymore where in the USA they lived - which people wanted to preserve as it was proven that they are the "origin" mustangs, with the purest ancient blood from the conquistadores' horses. They also had many grullos and duns in their herd. Are these horses related to them?

A nice grullo / grulla - perhaps as icing on the cake a silver grullo - would be a colour where I could get weak.

Could you let me know what the difference between Barbs and Spanish Barbs is? And are American Barbs Spanish Barbs or Barbs?

Poor Kimberlee, so many questions!

Hi Kim,

"Hopefully one day I will reply in besten deutsch! "

In bestem Deutsch !

No problem, I think, the most of us can understand English .

I think you wrong the Arabians. Don´t understand me wrong, I have mainly pure barb horses, but even Arab-Barbs. And I don´t think the influence of the Arabians make them headless. They have more will to work and I´m very pleased with them. I think it´s a problem of the kind of breeding the Arabians. For a long time the most of the breeders looked just after the appearance without thinking about having a good horse for riding. In Germany as well in the US. And in the US probably even more. Look at Halter-competitions for Quarter Horses. It´s no wonder that this kind of horses are not made for riding .
Because of this fact I am interested in the breeding standard of the Barbs in the US and which choice is made to choose a breeding stallion/mare.

The Barbs and the Arabians grew up in just the same area, very close together. We´re talking of other dimensions than they are usually in the US. The whole area of origin is just as large as a bigger federal state in the US, I think. It´s very familiar . The horses would only used for different purposes.

I really don´t know whether your mare would registrated at an European breeding association or the OMCB. I think just must ask the association directly. Perhaps they won´t, because a lot of the Barbs the German breeders own have papers with many of ancestors from Northern Africa inside. We´re closer to the roots of this race .

At least you have contact to Berb breeders here in Europe

And if you wish to improve your German just ask! We´re willing to help. in advance you could help us with our English !

haha I would be happy to help with your English! I work for Lufthansa in Colorado and most of the German passengers assume that I am German (I look German!) and are disappointed when I dont understand what they are saying. So, that is a big reason why I want to be fluent in German.

A Spanish Barb is a horse that has Barb, Mustang, and Peruvian Paso mixed all together. An American Barb is a horse descended from the original Barb in all of its vast array of colors (pinto, appaloosa, etc. are not American! Dont forget that all horses were imported from overseas!). The modern Barb in North Africa is documented to have Arabian and is no longer it its pure form from when it was imported to the Americas 500 years ago and is therefore a cousin to the American Barb.

The IBHR is trying to put together a performance test to have approved breeding horses. At this current point in time there is no test. I am considering having my mare approved by the American Sport Pony Registry. I believe this registry actually uses experienced judges from Europe.

If the OMCB's mission statement is to preserve the pure Barb horse then I would expect them to recognize the American Barb. I am not crossing my fingers though! lol I think that lots of politics would be involved.

At any rate, I am very happy to have a message board to talk about Barb horses; even if we do have different strains.

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Ein spanischer Berber ist ein Pferd, das Berberblut, Mustang hat, und Peruaner Paso alle zusammen mischte. Ein amerikanischer Berber ist ein Pferd stieg vom ursprünglichen Berber in ganzer seiner riesengroßen Reihe von Farben hinunter (Schecke, appaloosa, usw. sind nicht amerikanisch! Dont vergisst, dass alle Pferde von in Übersee importiert wurden!). Der moderne Berber im Nördlichen Afrika wird dokumentiert, um Araber zu haben, und ist es nicht mehr seine reine Form davon, als es in die Amerikas vor 500 Jahren importiert wurde und deshalb ein Vetter zum amerikanischen Berber ist.

Der IBHR versucht, einen Leistungstest zusammenzustellen, um Zuchtpferde genehmigt zu haben. An diesem gegenwärtigen Punkt rechtzeitig gibt es keinen Test. Ich denke, meine durch die amerikanische Sport-Pony-Registrierung genehmigte Stute zu haben. Ich glaube, dass diese Registrierung wirklich erfahrene Richter von Europa verwendet. Wenn die Missionsbehauptung des OMCB das reine Berber-Pferd dann bewahren soll, würde ich annehmen, dass sie den amerikanischen Berber anerkennen. Ich durchquere meine Finger obwohl nicht ich denke, dass viel Politik eingeschlossen würde.

Kimberlee

Verstehe ich das richtig:
Kimberlee - Du meinst die amerikanischen Berber wären "echter" als die
nordafrikanischen?

I tried to use the translator and it was terrible! lol

I do not think that the American Barb escaped Spanish breeding. Nor did the horse in North Africa. It is documented long before the Spanish had ruling over their own country that the Moors would transport Spanish and Barb horses back and forth from North Africa into Spain and vice versa. In fact there are American Barb horses that show a tendency to amble.

You must also not compare old Iberian horses with horses in Spain and Portugal today as they are all very mixed and did NOT found any Iberian breeds that are in America today unless noted. Such as the Azteca. The old Iberian horse was able to amble as well as trot. They did not grow very tall either. King Charles V of Spain crossed Danish warmblood horses with his famous Iberian warhorses and the modern Andalusian and Lusitano was then being formed. The King wanted a larger parade mount that was very flashy. Later, Thoroughbred and then Arabian was added to increase speed and agility for the bull ring. Dr. Deb Bennet states that there was not a drop of Arabian in the Iberian horse until the 1800's. The Barb had a large roll into developing the old Iberian warhorse. The Iberian horse also played a roll in developing the Barb which is why the two look similar. If you wish to look for a true old type Iberian horse then I believe that the Peruvian Paso would be your best bet.

As far as the Arabian goes. Nearly all of my horse friends greatly dislike them. They are known for being hot headed, not thinking, no awareness of themselves or you, stupid; and for those really not liking the extreme look of the Arab, then they are also very ugly. Personally, I have never enjoyed the look or the mindset of the Arabian. Some are just out right insane and the most stupid horse you will ever meet and others are just irritating, but not trying to kill themselves. I also greatly dislike their tendency to be very easily hurt. They tend to get themselves into trouble all of the time. I have found that the Arabian is a breed you either hate or love. There isn't a middle ground. I would personally never own one. This is of course just my opinion from my own personal experiences with the Arabian. You have obviously had a different experience than I have. Perhaps when I eventually go to Germany we can meet up and I can experience what you have! That would be lovely!

My Barb is hot, energetic, intelligent, sure footed, completely aware of her surroundings and me, trusts me to get her out of bad situations, fast, extremely agile, and very tough. She is also naturally built for dressage and would easily make an endurance horse. She also seems to understand my words. She is quite expressive in her face and body language. She never bites, kicks, rears up or strikes out unless she feels threatened. She also only likes me to ride her.

Personally, I do not think that the pure Barb exists. Meaning, in its original form. I think that the American Barb has a bit more Spanish blood than its cousins in North Africa. At the same time, the North African horses while also having Spanish blood has been greatly infused with Arabian. I think this is where they differ the most. I also do not think that just because a horse has been bred outside of its original country makes it any less a member of its breed. The IBHR is not trying to create a new breed, rather its goal is to preserve what we already have.

Oh, and about the dun and grulla mustangs you saw on TV. They have been specifically bred for those color patterns. Those horses are called Kiger Mustangs. They differ greatly in conformation and are by far NOT a Spanish breed! They like to say that to give them some sort of distinction. The breed can look like a bulldog Quarter Horse, a Morgan, an Arabian cross, and then a Spanish looking horse. Their genetics have placed them outside of the Iberian breed group. Therefore, genetically as well as historically, they are not Iberian. www.kigermustangs.org

I do not think that the North African Barb is better or lesser than the American Barb and vice versa. I think that they are both great horses of similar breeding.

Kimberlee

Here is a link to the IBHR/ISPBH/Barb history according to Robert Painter. He is very picky about where his pictures and information is published so I am just going to give you all a link so I dont offend him.

http://www.bulletinboards.com/message.c ... IBHS&x1=01

You may need to sign up for the board.

Kimberlee